Welcome to another delightful episode of The Scrumptious Woman, where Juliette is joined by the incredible Rabia. In this engaging conversation, Rabia, a neuropsychologist, shares her personal journey of transformation and how it led her to help families with neurodivergent children through mindfulness and compassionate parenting.
In this insightful episode, Rabia and Juliette explore the multifaceted aspects of neurodivergence, offering valuable insights for parents, families, and individuals. The conversation is a blend of personal experiences, professional expertise, and a forward-looking perspective on embracing neurodiversity.
- Self-Compassion is Key: Rabia emphasizes the importance of self-compassion for parents. Taking time for oneself and setting healthy boundaries contribute to a parent’s ability to provide better support.
- Understanding Neurodivergence: Rabia sheds light on the genetic aspect of neurodivergence and the need for parents to recognize and accept their own neurotypes. This understanding can help in creating a supportive environment for neurodivergent children.
- Tools for Parents and Children: Rabia advocates for giving parents tools to handle challenges and providing neurodivergent children with the necessary tools to navigate the world. This involves teaching mindfulness, self-compassion, and fostering a sense of autonomy.
- Navigating Family Gatherings: For families with neurodivergent children, Rabia suggests setting clear boundaries with extended family members during gatherings. Creating a sensory-safe space and respecting a child’s autonomy, especially in physical contact, are crucial considerations.
- Late Diagnoses and Misunderstandings: Rabia addresses the challenges faced by adults, especially women, in getting a correct diagnosis for conditions like autism. Late diagnoses often result from misinterpretations and misdiagnoses, highlighting the need for a nuanced understanding of neurodivergence.
- The Neurodiversity Affirming Paradigm: Rabia discusses the shift towards a neurodiversity affirming paradigm, which views neurodivergence as a normal variant of brain functioning rather than a disorder. This paradigm encourages identity-first language, putting the person before the condition.
Thank you for tuning in to The Scrumptious Woman. Remember, self-compassion and understanding lay the foundation for creating a nurturing environment for neurodivergent individuals.
Don’t forget to Rate and Subscribe to stay updated with all of the latest shows and resources.
Please leave a review so more people can tune in and the ripple effect spreads.
Go to https://feelfullyyou.com/Feel/ and use the code FEEL to get access to this course that is selling for £555. It is the first step into Feeling Fully You and Scrumptious. This is my gift to you!
The Scrumptious Woman EP41
Mindful Parenting, Parenting, Journey, Neurodivergent, Children, Mindfulness and Buddhism, Teaching Mindfulness, Parenting Tips, Family Expectations, Holiday Boundaries, Consent and Autonomy, Neurodivergence Awareness, Apologizing in Parenting
Juliette Karaman (01:14.102)
All right. Welcome to yet another episode of The Scrumptious Woman. And I have with me my beautiful sister, Rabia. You are a an incredible woman. You have tons and tons and tons of experience in helping people. Why don’t you just give a little short, short bio of who you help, what you do and how.
got here as well.
Juliette, thank you so much for that beautiful introduction. I can’t say anything beyond that. So to put it in a nutshell, I’m a neuropsychologist and had a very traditional professional career until I went through my own spiritual journey about 10 years ago now. And as a result of that journey, I realized that I needed to change things up in my personal life and my professional life.
And the reason I did that was because I was going through a divorce and my child, who’s autistic, had a lot of issues with dad leaving the picture. And honestly, it was really my fault because I couldn’t hold it together either. I was going through my own pain and we were just yelling at each other and it was not a healthy environment. And as a psychologist, I had extra blame and guilt that I wasn’t being the perfect parent or the perfect professional with my child.
not practicing what I preached and that’s yeah.
Juliette Karaman (02:47.474)
relate right as a professional like oh my god the guilt is even so much more
Yes, because you can help other people, but you can’t help your own family. And it was, uh, it was that mostly that guilt and that shame that led me to, um, start my journey on, um, spiritual discovery, mindfulness, Buddhism, ultimately to where I am today in Sufism.
Juliette Karaman (03:13.114)
Isn’t it incredible that often, even with all these tools that you’ve had at your disposal, right? And then you’ve been doing this for years before. Then when we hit that place where it’s like, oh my God, I’m going through this. There’s so much pain in my life now and I’m seeing my family also go through it. And then how can I help them more?
Yes, absolutely. Because I think as professionals also, we tend to forget about ourselves. And we also put a lot of blame on ourselves if we don’t follow through with, you know, and we’re even taught in our profession that you can’t treat your own family because you’re too close. There’s not that impartial and impartiality. And so, so I should have remembered that, but you know, when you’re in pain, you’re not thinking clearly and.
Ultimately, it was that I can’t go on like it is because this is not healthy for either one of us. And what is my role? It was my responsibility as the parent, not his. And so it was my, I took it upon me to do the journey because it’s like it’s not his work. He was nine and 10 at the time. It’s like, that’s my job.
Juliette Karaman (04:09.994)
Juliette Karaman (04:25.359)
It’s true, right? And we forget. I mean, our kids are here and they come through us and they’re on this journey on their own journey. But yet, as parents, you know, we try to hold them and guide them as much as we can, right? Like I keep saying, we give them roots and we give them wings and we can support them a little bit.
And one of the things that I got through that journey was that how can I also help other parents that are going through this? Because I have the professional background, right? And if I take it one step farther and add the spiritual piece to it, which what I did was I went through a lot of training with mindfulness because I really loved Buddhism. I was raised as a traditional Muslim. I always was okay with it, but there were always a lot of questions.
Juliette Karaman (04:56.47)
Juliette Karaman (05:08.457)
And I wasn’t sure if I wanted to switch, but I was sure I needed to do more work. And Buddhism I loved because I loved meditation. I loved the whole concept of mindfulness and self-compassion and all of the things that we were taught in Buddhism. And so I did the training, as I did the training in mindfulness and I became calmer.
Juliette Karaman (05:24.144)
and realized that I was no longer losing my cool when I was talking with my son, but I was able to be more patient and take a step back than I was really motivated to teach this to other parents because I was like, how many parents are raising neurodivergent children and are having some challenges and they’re not thinking about their children, they’re focused more on themselves and their own experience because they can’t get over their own pain. And so that’s what I did. So I started…
Juliette Karaman (05:52.807)
Juliette Karaman (06:07.036)
So, so true.
I created a program to teach families how to use mindfulness when parenting, using compassionate parenting, not being so, you know, using self-compassion for yourself, but then also having compassion for your child, being able to put yourself in your child’s shoes and see what is it like when your environment and your world is out of your control and you have to do what your parents tell you to do or what your teachers tell you to do in your neurodivergent.
Juliette Karaman (06:36.538)
So, so good. So if, just in a little nutshell, if what are two or three things that you would teach now having taught this to other parents? What are, like, if there are some parents that have neurodivergent kids and they’re like, ah, I don’t know how to deal with it, what are two things that you just, or two or three things that you’d say like, hey, do this now and it will make a huge difference?
Yeah, I think the number one thing I tell parents is to have self-compassion and take out some time for themselves because if you don’t recharge your soul battery, you have nothing to give to anybody else. And you are actually doing a disservice to your children if you are running on empty. So that is my number one thing. And I teach that all the time. I go on other podcasts and teach about how to be more self-compassionate. Don’t take on more blame. I mean, you take on blame from like so many years of…
Juliette Karaman (07:26.21)
you know, your childhood, your teenage years, college years, and then you get become a parent and then you take on more blame. So they never ends. And how can you start to ease that by making sure you’re taking time for yourself? You’re creating healthy boundaries, maybe at work or with your other family, because a lot of times some of the issues are that other family members don’t understand what it’s like to be neurodivergent or be a parent. Excuse me. And the other thing is neurodivergence is strongly genetic.
Juliette Karaman (07:56.855)
So chances are you have a child who’s neurodivergent, you probably are too, or your spouse is. So also coming to that realization, and that’s actually how I got into doing assessments with adults, is because so many of the parents were like, oh my gosh, my child is a mini me. There’s nothing wrong with my child, they’re just like me, I’m like, oh, maybe because you both have the same neuro-type. So that is also part of self-compassion.
Juliette Karaman (08:03.959)
Juliette Karaman (08:09.996)
Juliette Karaman (08:15.811)
Juliette Karaman (08:26.518)
starting to acknowledge that maybe you also have a different neuro-type and what does that feel like for you? How do you react to that? How do you handle that? How do you accept it and be a model for your child? Or are you fighting it as well? So that would be the first thing I would teach. The second thing would be not to forget to have fun as a parent, because so often we get mired down in…
Juliette Karaman (08:36.829)
Juliette Karaman (08:49.528)
Juliette Karaman (08:54.03)
in parenting and then if you have children who have extra challenges and they’re struggling in school or at home, that’s something else you take on and you forget. You forget that your child is only going to be young for so long and you get mired down in the nitty gritty and you forget to have fun. And so, you know, I tell parents do compassionate parenting. Let let go of your expectations of what a neurotypical standard for parenting is. You don’t need to have
Juliette Karaman (09:24.291)
rules and regulations, you can do what’s called low demand parenting, where you literally let the child be guided by what they want in their environment. You know, you set boundaries very clearly, of course, but you also don’t get so hung up on some of the things that neurotypical parenting has instilled in us is typical. So rules, regulations, discipline, discipline can look like a lot of different things. It doesn’t need to be very
If you have children who are neurodivergent and they have what’s known as a PDA profile, which is, or they call it EDA now, extreme desire for autonomy, they need control in their lives. And if they lose control, they can’t handle it. Their brain can’t handle it. And so when you realize that it’s a neuro-type and it’s not your child being stubborn, then you can start to let go of some of those parenting demands.
Juliette Karaman (10:05.503)
Juliette Karaman (10:20.102)
Isn’t that true though? Because I know one of my, I’ve got two children that have a lot of, have high severe dyslexia and my son more than my daughter or struggled with it more in school. And I know for him one of the things that was the most difficult was change. So when we got divorced he really suffered and he wanted to know where everything was in the house and if anything got moved around
He would panic and it’s really now he’s 24. And even now I notice where he still finds those things challenging. So it’s just to know that and to come at it like, you know, with compassion. And also to give him some tools to deal with that and to deal with how to interact with his siblings and how to interact with work and with finding a job that, you know,
Yes, there’s always going to be change and that’s the only one thing that we know is going to be constant.
Yes, you make an excellent point. Just the idea of how can we give our children tools so they can start to handle these issues themselves. Because you’re gonna face, you know, you can be as accommodating as you want in your house, but then they’re gonna go out into the real world and the real world is not as accommodating. And how can we prepare them for that world unless they’re going into a neurodivergent world, which is, we’re not quite there yet, which I hopefully we will be. I think that it’s-
Juliette Karaman (11:40.642)
Juliette Karaman (11:49.134)
I’m going to go get a drink.
giving our children the tools and we can’t do that unless we can model that for ourselves and we can model that for our children. How do you handle it when you lose your temper? How do you react? How you react is what your children are going to pick up. And so if you’re constantly yelling at your money…
Juliette Karaman (12:01.178)
Juliette Karaman (12:06.062)
And it’s funny, right, because you’re saying that, you know, through your divorce and then how you were short tempered and I remember being like that too. And I was like, oh, a wall would have understood by now. Right. And it’s like, oh, okay. Is this part of my awakening where I’m like really recognizing, like, and I’ve spent the last 10 years or 15 years making amends for my children just saying, hey, you know, that wasn’t the best way of parenting.
They’re like, oh no, mommy, it was fine. You’re the best mommy in the world. I’m like, hey, if they had given me a proper parenting book, I would have still fucked up. But you know what? It’s OK. We we make our way through it. And I think what they like most is that I’m actually really being human about it and saying, hey, I didn’t know better at that point. And they have really seen where I’ve calmed down, where I’ve given them tools. I’ve given myself tools.
and me, my ex-husband get along really well. Or it’s like, mommy, actually what’s happened because of this, because of the divorce and because of you learning this stuff is that our life has changed. And it’s also, we’ve learned a lot of new things.
Oh my gosh, you can’t do any better than that. When your kids have learned something from you, right? I mean, it’s all we want. We want to teach our children things that help us and hope that they pick up on that. And that’s beautiful that your children have come to that point. I’m just praying mine will too.
Juliette Karaman (13:35.571)
Juliette Karaman (13:42.822)
That’s all we can do, right? And then I just remember with the four kids and then coming to see my parents and they had such strict rules and it was like, okay, so trying to organize my kids on one side and then the grandparents or what they wanted and their rules in their house. And it was just like, I know a lot of people now going through, coming to the holidays where…
they might be fearful of like, hey, we have a neurodivergent child or we have a child with.
certain things that he or she wants, right, or they want, and they’re quite vocal about it, and then we have quite conservative parents that are like, no, kids should be seen but not heard. How do you kind of intermarry that? How do you keep your cool while you’re the bridge between both worlds?
Yeah, that’s a really good question. I actually used to do a couple of classes around that every year around the holidays, because that is something that can be a point of contention, especially if your parents don’t, or your family doesn’t understand what neurodivergence is. And so I think one of the key things is to have a very strong, have to very strong boundaries around what is acceptable and what is not, and make it very clear to your family that if that cannot be accommodated or if that is not,
something they can offer, then you will have to either leave early or, you know, have it at your house if you can control the environment. I know a lot of people who choose to just refrain from going to the relatives on the actual holiday, but maybe going a couple of days here and there, you know, like on the other side of the actual holiday. So they avoid the crowd. It’s, you know, a lot of things, a lot of the issues are around the crowds, right? If you have your entire family coming.
Juliette Karaman (15:32.858)
and your children are not very good in crowded situations or noises, which a lot of sensory sensitivities happen with neurodivergence, then you can offer to say, I’ll come the day after Thanksgiving or the day after Christmas. And so they can see their grandparents, but it’s not being in that crowd, not having the multilayered noises and sounds. And maybe it’s easier for the grandparents or the family to make more accommodations available. You can also offer to take your own food for your children so they don’t.
Juliette Karaman (16:01.518)
They don’t say, oh, I don’t want to eat any of this because that is another issue. The parents are like, oh, if I made it, you need to eat it. And a lot of children have food issues. So there are a lot of allowances that you can make that will make sure that your child and your family has a good time. But I think it’s really important that you’re very clear up front that this is what we can handle and this is what we cannot.
Juliette Karaman (16:09.131)
So if the crowds or the noises or the food or whatever is the situation, is there a way we can be accommodated? Can we have a quiet space where the children can have, you know, like a sensory safe area where they can play or they can be served their food? And can we please tell everybody that they don’t, they have consent for when they want to be hugged or kissed or whatever, because that’s another issue. That’s an important one.
Juliette Karaman (16:32.094)
Juliette Karaman (16:57.927)
Such a good one. That’s one of the ones that I now look at myself. I’m like, oh my God, how often have I told my kids to go and give Auntie whoever a kiss? And they’re like, oh, I don’t like them. I’m like, no, don’t embarrass me. So yeah, so definitely waking up and being a parent and then looking back at what we might’ve not done so right is…
where we can have the giggles, we can have the guilt and the shame, or we can actually have the giggle and say, oopsie, okay. Learned from that and not doing that again.
Yes. And I actually apologized to my son for that. I said, you know, I’ve, I’ve learned since then that was culturally, that’s how we were brought up. And we thought that’s just something you have to set up, but no, that’s not okay. And he still talks about having to do that. So, so I will, I have apologized and I said, I’m really sorry. I didn’t know any better when I made you go hug people and you didn’t want to, I should have honored your request and given you a talk about consent over your body.
Juliette Karaman (17:41.506)
Juliette Karaman (18:00.558)
talk about consent, autonomy, all of this, right? And this is what I talk to mine about as well. And they’re like, oh, mommy, you know? But that was the thing. We were just taught to do that. And it’s like, you were taught to do this. And now I actually recognize, now we go into our bodies, like, no, we don’t wanna hug someone. We’ll just kind of like, yeah, this is my space. If you come in too close, I don’t like it. And they’re actually now quite, especially the girls are quite.
So, and he’s 20 years old.
Juliette Karaman (18:28.33)
audible that they speak about it. They’re like, hey, this feels like a good space. Don’t come too close.
Yes, yes. And I think it’s so wonderful that we are now teaching our children that. There’s so many things that I wish I had known when I was a new parent that I know now. But again, I’m like, I have so much hope for the next generation because they are learning these things from the start. And so that has to help somewhere.
Juliette Karaman (18:52.27)
Juliette Karaman (18:56.442)
I love it. Now you were saying that you test on neurodivergency. How if people are like thinking like, I think something’s up with my kids and I’m not sure where do I even go? How do I start looking into this?
So I do assessments for adults just for autism or ADHD. And I tend to focus on women, gender, queer, and trans folks because this is a very underserved population and one that’s easily misdiagnosed, especially for autism, because autism in women are in gender, queer, or trans folks looks very different than what it looks like in men. And so a lot of people, right? So a lot of.
Juliette Karaman (19:17.923)
Juliette Karaman (19:25.07)
Juliette Karaman (19:37.058)
A lot of these populations, when they go to a doctor, they get misdiagnosed with everything under the sun except autism. Usually it’s something like borderline personality disorder plus social anxiety plus ADHD plus and even ADHD is hard to get. Most of the time it’s like, oh, you’re just anxious. And they go straight to BPD, which is not even supposed to be easily diagnosed. And most of the time these women come to me and they’re autistic. And I’m like, well, that’s…
Juliette Karaman (19:57.71)
And the reason they find out is because they’re watching like TikTok videos, or they’re seeing other women who are diagnosed late talking about their traits. And they realize they recognize some of those traits in themselves. And they’re like, oh my gosh, I’ve been, maybe I’m not borderline personality disorder. Maybe it’s autism. And so most people find me on my website. Interestingly, I don’t have, most of my clients have just found me through Google, which,
Juliette Karaman (20:37.091)
And speaking which Juliette, I know you that’s your love language. Uh, if they’re meant to find me, they’ll find me. And I’ve put this out into the universe. I’m like, I don’t even want a waiting list. I’ve actually put this out. I’ve meditated and said, I don’t want a waiting list because I want people who find me to be able to come in right away. And I want just the perfect clients who are here for me. And that’s exactly what I get every month. I get the perfect number of clients and there’s no waiting list. And so it’s, um,
It’s beautiful how that’s worked out, but the people who find me have just randomly found me on Google and they’re like, I just, it is, it’s beautiful because they go into it knowing that I come from a kind of a non-traditional perspective, because I’m really heavily into the woo woo. And so I want to be able to speak about some of that with my clients. Um, and I do, and I bring in some of my coaching into my clients, uh, assessments. Um, so it works out really well. I’ve.
Juliette Karaman (21:11.263)
Isn’t it incredible?
had such joy in helping people figure out what’s going on and how, you know, really validating their experience of what they thought they were quirky or unique or weird or whatever. I’m like, no, you just had a different neurotype. There was nothing wrong with you. It was the people around you. And they didn’t understand.
Juliette Karaman (21:54.174)
Isn’t it interesting? Yeah. Isn’t it interesting? Because I’ve worked with mostly boys actually from the age of 11 to like 14 when I first started working with autism and now it’s been all the way up to like the early 20s. And I just love work and it’s mostly
Autism, it’s always been high functioning autism and it’s always been boys or young men, right? Which is really interesting. It’s lately I’ve had a few women as well, but it’s mostly been boys and they work very different than females at that point or what you’re…
Juliette Karaman (22:41.958)
Such an interesting perspective and I think it’s something that often gets overlooked.
Yeah, I think we’re having an awakening. So to speak of neurodivergence, I’d like to tell people this is gonna be the next frontier that we conquer because we’ve kind of addressed ethnicity, sexual identity, all those kinds of diversities, but we haven’t touched on neurodivergence yet, especially in the US with the medical model being as it is, it’s very deficit-based. Everything is about being a problem or a disease or a disorder.
Juliette Karaman (23:15.16)
And the neurodiversity affirming paradigm takes the stance that these are not disorders. These are just neuro types. It’s a normal variant of brain functioning. It’s just found less than it is the neuro normative neurotype. And so that stance, which also gives more credibility to lived voices of people who are actually neurodivergent versus the professionals.
Juliette Karaman (23:29.18)
takes away some of that harmful language, puts people with the person first versus, I mean, identity first language, like you’re autistic, you have autism. So a lot of those things I think have been long in the making, and I hope that we’re getting to the point where they will become more common place.
Juliette Karaman (24:07.302)
It’s such a good point what you’re saying. It’s, it’s, yeah, you have certain traits or you have certain things or you, you’re exhibiting things like behaviour. I remember when I made that switch with my children, it’s not like you are bad, it’s like the behaviour that you just did right now, don’t like that. Yeah, but just pointing out that they’re not bad, but it, that’s like exactly what you’re talking about here with, um,
autism, neurodivergent. It’s really like learning that it’s not the totality of who they are, but it’s just how their brain is wired, basically, right?
Yeah. So just, just keeping, just, just be remembering to, um, uh, not say the person has something because that kind of implies that it’s a disorder or disease at something. There’s nothing broken that needs to be fixed. Basically everything is just as it should be. And when I used to diagnose, uh, younger children, so I used to, I started out diagnosing children. I would tell them it was like their brain, um, was, had a, um, like
Juliette Karaman (24:49.463)
Juliette Karaman (25:02.54)
neurotypical brains were set for like a straight highway to get to the destination, but their brains was taking the scenic route. And that kind of appealed to them. Right? Because I’m like, who doesn’t want the scenic route? So it’s not, there’s nothing wrong. It’s just you’re taking a different path to get to the same destination.
Juliette Karaman (25:23.246)
Oh, I love that.
Juliette Karaman (25:29.367)
Juliette Karaman (25:33.342)
Isn’t it? But isn’t it cool? I remember asking my son to go and get me my pink tweezers. And he came back and said, Mummy, you just have a pair of red ones. I was like, OK, I call it pink. He called it red. And he showed it to me because he picked it up from the other side. And on that side, there are red. I’m like, I’ve never seen it that way. So for me, it’s always been like you see things in a slightly different way than I did. And it’s all perfect.
Yeah. And just, you know, just, just honoring those, um, differences in a way that empowers people is really what I feel like my job is, is I just want, I just want people to be empowered in their neuro type and not feel lesser than cause there is no lesser than is there’s just different and a lot of ways or there are a lot of challenge, a lot of strengths and a lot of things that neurodivergence can offer the world that we
Juliette Karaman (26:02.727)
Juliette Karaman (26:22.057)
don’t appreciate fully and I feel like we should. And I don’t know if I mentioned this earlier, but I actually realized I was neurodivergent earlier this year. So it was quite a shock. I was talking to a colleague and I happened to, I was like, I have so much in common with my clients and she’s like, what? And I was telling her, she goes, you have sensory processing differences. You do realize that, don’t you? I was like, what? So actually, yeah, so I did some testing and talked to a professional and I have sensory processing differences and I’m an empath, which
Juliette Karaman (26:37.108)
Actually, you’re an empath too, so you are also neurodivergent. So people don’t realize what it, people don’t realize what it, what neurodivergence really means. It just means you’re not fitting the regular mainstream neuro types. If you are an empath, if you have sensory processing differences, if you are dyslexic or, you know, you’re an ADHDer, you’re,
Juliette Karaman (27:03.818)
feel the whole world.
Even there’s a difference between innate and acquired neurodivergence. So like anxiety is an acquired one, which can or cannot happen. And it can also be treated. So that’s one thing where if it’s an acquired neurodivergence, you can technically treat it. But for innate neurodivergence, like ADHD, autism, dyspraxia, dyscalculia, dyslexia, you don’t treat those because those aren’t things that need to be treated. Those are just your brain. But there are the acquired ones you can technically treat and they can go away.
Juliette Karaman (27:30.902)
Juliette Karaman (27:53.283)
Um, but if you have any of the quality ones, you’re still neurodivergent. So there are more, probably more people neurodivergent than there are neuro-typical at this point, but they just don’t know it.
Juliette Karaman (28:04.19)
Isn’t it incredible? Cause when I started looking around, I’m like, oh, my ex-husband’s brother who passed away, I’m like, I looked at my own brother. I look and look at myself. I’m like, oh, I’m a massive empath. I feel so much. It’s like the whole world is, and I’m feeling the whole world’s feeling. I’m like, oh, okay. Hello. Well, they got it from both sides. So it doesn’t really matter as long as we just, just give tools, right? That that’s all we can really do.
Honor, empower, and give the tools.
Juliette Karaman (28:35.614)
Absolutely. This has been an absolute delight. Thank you so much. Please can you let people know where they can find you? They’re like, yes, I want to hear a little bit more about you. We only touched on like a tiny bit of what you do and who you are on this world.
Thank you so much for having me. This has been an amazing and wonderful conversation. Yeah, so I have two websites. One is for my professional medical, or not medical, sorry, psychological services. And that is drrabia.com, D-R-R-A-B-I-A.com. And then I also have a coaching site and where I’ll be selling some programs for neurodivergence on self-compassion and spirituality and such. And that is quantumcon, Q-U-A-N-T-U-M, QUN.com. I hope I spelled that right.
Juliette Karaman (29:24.98)
I’ll double check it, make sure that it goes into the show notes. Rabia, this has been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for coming on.
Thank you, love. It’s wonderful.